Ramsay, John - Lot 13 1a 2 3a

Birth Name Ramsay, John - Lot 13
Gender male
Age at Death less than about 76 years

Events

Event Date Place Description Notes Sources
Birth about 1770 Princetown, Prince Edward Island daughter Flora said father b. Scotland
 
Death before 1846 Prince Edward Island, Canada Not on the rent roll for Lot 13 c. 1845
 

Parents

Relation to main person Name Relation within this family (if not by birth)
Father Ramsay, Donald - Lot 13
Mother McMillan, Mary
         Ramsay, John - Lot 13
    Brother     Ramsay, Donald Daniel
    Brother     Ramsay, Neil - Lot 14
    Sister     Ramsay, Mary
    Brother     Ramsay, Archibald
    Brother     Ramsay, Angus
    Brother     Ramsay, Malcolm - Lot 11
    Brother     Ramsay, Michael - Lot 12
    Sister     Ramsay

Families

    Family of Ramsay, John - Lot 13 and Penman, Margaret
Married Wife Penman, Margaret
   
Event Date Place Description Notes Sources
Marriage May 1795 Prince Edward Island, Canada Margaret was from Lot 13, according to license dated 4 May 1795
 
  Children
  1. Ramsay, Donald
  2. Ramsay, George
  3. Ramsay, Mary
  4. Ramsay, David
  5. Ramsay, Neil Jr.
  6. Ramsay, Jane
  7. Ramsay, Margaret
  8. Ramsay, Christiana Christy
  9. Ramsay, Flora
  10. Ramsay, John

Narrative

It is widely accepted that John Ramsay was the son of Donald Ramsay and Mary McMillan, born on Prince Edward Island after his parents emigrated from Scotland. Since Donald was one of the Ramsay brothers who settled in Lot 13, this seems a reasonable supposition. John would have been the eldest, or second eldest son, if his parents followed the traditional naming patterns of the day, named for his paternal grandfather. Past and Present of PEI called him "Justice John," because he was the only magistrate in his locality. He was a "son of Donald Ramsey, who was a son of John Ramsey."

John Ramsay did not have a farm in Lot 13 in 1793, when Grey made a trip across Lot 13 and sketched a map of farms in the area. He married two years later. There was a marriage license for John Ramsay and Margaret Penman dated May 4 1795. Both were from Lot 13. John Ramsay is listed by the landlord Seymour's agent as having been in Lot 13 from 1796.

John Ramsay was in the 1798 census of Prince Edward Island, in Lot 13, with a household of 4: 2 males under 16, and a man and a woman over 16.

There was a John Ramsay on Seymour's 1824 rent roll for Lot 13, described as the father of Donald. There was no John Ramsay on the 1846 rent roll. Neither was he in the incomplete 1841, 1861, or 1881 census records of PEI. (None of the households headed by a John Ramsay in the 1861 census, were old enoughto be him, and there was only one household of Ramsays in Lot 13 that had a man over 60).

There was no record for him in the PEI Death Cards. If he left a will, it was not in Linda Jean Nicholson's comprehensive book, Early Prince Edward Island Probate Records 1786-1850. John was alive in 1837, when he transferred his property in Lot 13, giving 50 acres to his son George, and the same to his son-in-law Samuel McAusland. His wife did not sign these documents - usually a requirement - so it is assumed that Margaret Penman died before 1837.

Much of what we have for John and Margaret is hearsay. The names of their children came from local histories and other family trees. No baptismal records were found and John did not leave a will. The history of Port Hill, Launched, said their children were: Donald, Margaret, George, David, Jane, Neil, Flora, John, Christine and Sarah Adeline. Based on her dates, Sarah Adeline is more likely to have been a grand-daughter. Two sons were born before 1798, probably the sons named after their grandfathers, Donald and George. All of their daughters were born after the 1798 census. Although I haven't seen this, PEI Archives has the family bible of D. C. Ramsay & Annie Gillis, with entries filled in by a descendant. Children for John Ramsay and Margaret Penman given were Donald, George, David, Neil, and John Ramsay, Margaret, Mrs. Anderson; Jennie, Mrs. Ellis; Flora, Mrs. Samuel McAuslane and Christy, Mrs. Brooks. Other possible children could be:
-One of the two men named Angus Ramsay who went to New Brunswick, born 1811 or 1812
-The Archibald Ramsay who married his cousin, Sarah Ramsay
-The James Ramsay, born 1801, who went to New Brunswick

I have added the Margaret Ramsay who married Henry Folland to this family. She was from Lot 13, and one would expect this family to have a Margaret, named for her mother. The daughter Margaret who was said to have married Mr. Anderson turned out to be Mary Ramsay.

When Seymour made a trip around the Island in 1840, he mentioned the Ramsays of Lot 13 in his diary "Loads of Ramsays the old with keen Eyes the young with sinister dissatisfied looks tho well grown - keen about taking land
but not disposed Yeo says to work."

Farms under the name Ramsay on the 1846 rent roll for Lot 13 were Alex, Donald Jr., George, William, David, and two more Donalds. There were two men named John Ramsay on the 1855 subscription list for the Patriot's Fund in Port Hill, one being Neil's son. David and Donald C. Ramsay were on this list. A map of Lot 13 shows David and John Jr.'s properties on the Trout River.

In the absence of contemporary records, we can look at names we might expect to find in a family. On the Penman side, Ann, Elizabeth, Christy, Jane, Mary, Margaret, George and David; on the Ramsay side, Donald, Mary, Neil, Archibald, Angus, Malcolm, Michael, and John. The usual child-bearing span for a woman was about 25 years, from 1795-1820 for Margaret, and many women had children every two years. For Margaret and John, that would be Donald, George, Mary, David, Neil, Margaret, Jane, Christy Ann, Flora, and John - there is space for Angus in 1812, and perhaps even Archibald in 1817. Flora is the only name that sticks out, but John transferred land to his son in law Samuel McAusland, Flora's husband, so she belongs in this family.

 

 

 

 

Pedigree

  1. Ramsay, Donald - Lot 13
    1. McMillan, Mary
      1. Ramsay, John - Lot 13
        1. Penman, Margaret
          1. Ramsay, Donald
          2. Ramsay, George
          3. Ramsay, Mary
          4. Ramsay, David
          5. Ramsay, Neil Jr.
          6. Ramsay, Jane
          7. Ramsay, Margaret
          8. Ramsay, Christiana Christy
          9. Ramsay, Flora
          10. Ramsay, John
      2. Ramsay, Donald Daniel
      3. Ramsay, Neil - Lot 14
      4. Ramsay, Mary
      5. Ramsay, Angus
      6. Ramsay, Archibald
      7. Ramsay, Malcolm - Lot 11
      8. Ramsay, Michael - Lot 12
      9. Ramsay

Source References

  1. Dyment, Jane: Ancestry Family Trees
      • Page: Ancestry Family Trees
  2. Transcribed and indexed by Elizabeth A. Glen : License Cash Books of the Colonial Secretary of Prince Edward Island
  3. 1798 Census of Prince Edward Island
      • Date: 1798
      • Page: Lot 13